Re: [Xen-devel] [RFC] ARM VM System Sepcification

[Grant Likely <grant.likely@xxxxxxxxxx>]

On Thu, 06 Mar 2014 10:46:22 +0100, Paolo Bonzini <pbonzini@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Il 06/03/2014 09:52, Robie Basak ha scritto:
> > On Sat, Mar 01, 2014 at 03:27:56PM +0000, Grant Likely wrote:
> >> I would also reference section 3.3 (Boot Option Variables Default Boot
> >> Behavior) and 3.4.1.1 (Removable Media Boot Behavior) here. It's fine to
> >> restate the meaning of the requirement in this spec, but the UEFI spec
> >> is the authoritative source. Distributed VM disk images fall under the
> >> same scenario as the firmware not having any valid boot variables.
> >
> > What happens when the VM is first booted without boot variables, but
> > then the OS expects to be able to set boot variables and see them on
> > next boot?
> 
> UEFI scans the devices; looks for an EFI system partition on the disks; 
> and builds a default boot order.
> 
> > If possible, I would prefer to mandate that the host implementation is
> > permitted to no-op (or otherwise disable) boot variable write operations
> > altogether to avoid having to deal with this. In the common case, I
> > don't see why an OS installation shipped via a VM disk image would need
> > to write boot variables anyway.
> >
> > Would there be any adverse consequences to doing this?
> 
> Given the experience on x86 UEFI, no.
> 
> Unlike bare metal, it is common to run UEFI VMs without persistent flash 
> storage.  In this case the boot variables and boot order are rebuilt on 
> the fly on every boot, and it just works for both Windows and Linux; 
> there's no reason why it should be any different for ARM.
> 
> > My reason is that this would save us from blocking a general OpenStack
> > implementation on ARM by requiring that these pieces are implemented
> > further up the stack first, when it would bring actual gain to doing so.
> >
> > This would not preclude host implementations from implementing writeable
> > variables, or guests from using them. Just that for a _portable VM disk
> > image_, the OS on it cannot assume that this functionality is present.
> 
> This is already the case for most OSes.  Otherwise you wouldn't be able 
> to move a hard disk from a (physical) machine to another.
> 
> I strongly suggest that you take a look at the work done in Tiano Core's 
> OvmfPkg, which has support for almost every QEMU feature thanks to the 
> work of Laszlo Ersek and Jordan Justen.
> 
> In particular, OvmfPkg has support for specifying a boot order in the VM 
> configuration (which maps to the "-boot" option in QEMU).  In this case, 
> the UEFI boot order is overridden by a variable that is placed in some 
> architecture-specific firmware configuration mechanism (on x86 we have 
> one called fw_cfg, on ARM you could look at the fdt).  This predates 
> UEFI and is not a UEFI variable; in fact is is a list of OpenFirmware 
> device paths.  UEFI will match the OF paths to UEFI paths, and use the 
> result to build a UEFI boot order.

I don't know why we wouldn't want to make the UEFI variable the
mechanism for exposing VM boot order to UEFI and the OS. I do completely
agree that the boot order should be owned by the VM and be able to be
manipulated from the config file and command line.

g.

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